Hi-I know I'm about to give away which country I am but I have a real dilemma. Is this a war game or isn't it? I have allies-that's what they're for. I pushed the button "message all allies" and used the feature to ask the allies to help me attack another country. The owner of the country (keep in mind these are IN-game allies) anyways the owner of the country I wanted to attack claimed he could have my account shut down for contacting my offense and defense allies through the "message all allies" button and asking them to help me attack an opponent-isn't this what we have allies for?

It is considered coordination.

BUT IMO this should be allowed. Diplomacy is part of the game and as long as it's all communicated within the game I don't see why not.

It's not allowed.

See this thread:
http://forums.earthempires.com/...rification-on-group-kills

So bossy blid...

then any group of players could just as easily all pact each other, coordinate killing countries outside of the game and send each other messages in game so it looks legit to admins.

The only allowed allies in this server (and all solo servers) should just be Intel and Def allies.

So invite some of your friends to play and kill em back. But honestly, I feel like most of the time the people that would enlist allies to fight are non-alliance players.

That kind of bond might be what keeps ppl in the game or adds new players. Look at all MMO's now, it's the SOCIAL aspect that got ppl playing in the first place and it's what keeps ppl playing.

If there were a server w/ primary rules but allowed in-game coordination but not clans, I think that would make the game more fun. And then make primary like tourney server - no allies, no msging, etc. Purely individualistic like how the pure netters want so nothing is abusable.

Alliance server started out exactly like that. There were no tags - but people managed to coordinate large amounts of countries just the same, using both ingame and out of game methods. That's not the direction we want to go for this server.

I just think some of these 'coordination' rules are too strict. It turns off a lot of non top 50 players from wanting to play more than a few sets I feel.

You do realize there are already 3 (III) THREE 'social' servers. So what exactly are you saying keeps people from playing again?

And make Primary like Tourney? Why? We need 2 tourney servers?

its a solo server, the intent is solo play, if you want help from friends go play one of the clan servers as thats what those are for.

i also agree with xin there should only be defense and intel allies. offense and research allies can be abused and takes away from true solo play.

IMO....if u can't fight your own battles then don't play a solo server!

it's dumb that allies are allowed at all.

should just nerf the PS to give a smaller attack bonus and then ban all allies.

problem solved.

[/quote]its a solo server, the intent is solo play, if you want help from friends go play one of the clan servers as thats what those are for.

i also agree with xin there should only be defense and intel allies. offense and research allies can be abused and takes away from true solo play. [/quote]

It may be a "solo server" but it allows you to have 3 offense allies and 2 defense allies. What are these allies for? They are for just what I used them for. There is NOTHING in the written rules to forbid what I'm doing. My understanding is that it is called the "Solo" server because you can only have one account NOT because it is a "go it alone" server. I've been playing this game for over a decade-first on swerve.com and now here and I've never heard anyone say any of these things about the primary game and, I repeat, it doesn't violate any written rules nor does it violate the concept of having allies nor does it violate the idea of a solo (solo meaning you can own ONE country) server.

When you are using them against the "Spirit of the Rules" of fair play, then yes it is forbidden. This is why DR-abuse on Express is a deletable offense, even though the in-game mechanics allows for it.

As for the idea of a solo server, SOLO doesn't mean one country. Every other server including the clan servers except FFA also only allow one country, but Alliance and Team are definitely non-solo servers.

You didn't read the page I linked to I can tell. "What are these allies for?" It's funny when people use that line for this argument when there's clearly something else they're for, you know, the built-in function that they serve? Like every time you get hit and your allies send 25% of their defense and etc. *That's* what they're for! Nothing more. The stuff about having only one account is just you being silly, ALL non-ffa servers require you to have only one account, including alliance servers.

How in the heck is it against the "spirit of the rules of fair play" to use your offense and defense allies to strike back at a nation that has attacked your country, killed your people and destroyed your infrastructure? That's what war and having allies is all about.

"Solo as in one country" sorry for the confusion between country and account. As for not reading the link you posted-unless you invented the game Earth 2025 or it's copycat earth empires your opinion is just that: your opinion. Again I have violated NO rules nor have I violated the "spirit of the rules of fair play" it is fair to count on your allies to strike back at those who have wronged the people of your nation.

where is this rule against "coordination" located on the earthempires.com website? I've clicked on the "Rules" link at the bottom of the pages and do not see it listed. Thanks for agreeing with me though

Great because I'm not advocating going that direction. I have in-game allies that are defined on my "relations" page and I communicate with those allies through the button that says "Message allies" which is also provided by the server. Why program the website with a button to "message allies" if we aren't supposed to speak to them about our relationship as defense allies?

@grantman77: The rule is on the forums http://forums.earthempires.com/...&z=rule-clarification

@crest23: Instead of thinking of the biggest douche bag comment to write, please read what's written and think about what ppl are actually saying.

Do primary server and tourney server have the same rules? No. So what I am saying, and what everyone else in the world who's not a dumb fluff understands what I'm saying but for some reason I have to explain it to you in dumb fluff terms, is having a server with the length of primary, rules of primary (aka turn time, GDI rules, market rules) but have no allies/interactions like in tourney. UNDERSTAND YET??

And yes I know there are 3 'social' servers, but they all have clans and when you have official clans you have stupid rules that people make up and try to enforce which makes the game horrible to play - which, I guess I have to spell out for you since you're a dumb fluff who can't understand anything, keeps ppl from wanting to play them. Hence why I said a server without clans but with looser rules.

@Everyone else: I don't think havin O allies and PSing your jets away everyday is wrong, nor do I think leeching tech is wrong AS LONG AS the goal of your allies countries weren't created for the sole purpose of letting you leech. It's not my responsibility to look out for the best interest of other countries but rather my own. It's the same thing w/ D and Intel allies. If I have 400k spies and my intel ally has 100k, isn't he pretty much leeching? Or if I have 1m turrets and my ally has 250k turrets, isn't that essentially leeching? This is why I check my allies every few days to make sure they're up to par with me, otherwise I cancel the pacts and find better allies.

In the same way, if I stop teching and don't break my tech pact it's my tech allies responsibilities to realize that I'm no longer teching (either by assuming from news, asking me, or spying on me) and breaking the pact. Or if my O ally never gets to use my jets, it's my allies responsibilities to realize this and break the pact.

Using the rules to your advantage, as long as it's not illegal, is smart (hell take a look at politicians). Think about how the netters use GDI rules for their advantage, what's the difference? And if the game mods/devs don't like the way their rules are being used it's their job to change it (AKA Sean Avery rule in the NHL).

Of course leeching tech is wrong... it unlevels the playing field.

You can use the jets of your allies to strike back at people that have attacked your country. No problem with that. That is what allies is about.

What isn't allowed is asking your in-game allies to ALSO attack them - that's coordination. "In game ally" really just means just that - a country that sends you some units to attack/defend - they are not people you can call on to gangbang someone else.

What if you did a tech startup and provided more tech early on for a techer than what he gave you during that time? Is that leeching if you don't cancel it right away? Is it the leecher or techer's responsibility to cancel the pact? What if you're D allied with your research ally also and as the tech leecher you provide more defense in that pact? Is that still leeching or is that mutually beneficial? Furthermore, is it coordination if you say to your tech ally: 'hey you provide me tech and I'll provide you D'?

Oh good to know, instead of directing him to the multiple servers that he can do exactly what he says he wants to do, let's create a whole new server for him that we guarantee there won't be rules created by the players. You are so smart. Very detailed thinking you have there, I'm so impressed.

You can torture yourself with those hypotheticals, I'm not really interested. Just saying, "leeching tech" is wrong and you were saying it wasn't a minute ago.

I'm just sayin, it's wrong in your eyes, but it's not against the rules so it's perfectly valid thing to do. Just like how I think it's ridiculous you guys are all over qwertyh for having O-allies. He's not breaking any rules, he merely found a way within the rules to get an advantage. It's something that's available to anyone, you just chose not to use it. I choose not to use O-allies, not cuz I think it's wrong, but because I don't want to bother with timing my hits and losing jets from my O-allies - but it doesn't mean I think nobody else should be allowed to use it.

I don't really care if straight up leeching tech is currently allowed by the rules, it's pretty easy to objectively realize it unlevels the playing field and that that's not a good thing. It's clearly more unbalancing than a def ally, how often do top players ever get grabbed? And at least then the pact goes in both directions, straight up leeching is just unacceptable by any reasonable measure besides, "I can technically get away with it, at least until someone plows me for it."

I have to say it's nice being in the bleachers for this one.

I do agree with LATC that it's the social component of the game that keeps players like me playing this. (Or else I can find a multitude of other ways to punch numbers and use my spreadsheet)

If a person doesn't frequent the forums to look for game rules-and looks here where one expects game rules to be posted I don't see the problem: http://www.earthempires.com/rules
Furthermore you are a dirty and rude person for using terms like "douchebag" and you ought to be banned from the forums for your confrontational attitude. It seems like you are trying to pick a physical fight and that's a "no-no" according to some rules I've read in regards to forum postings. As I stated before I have played this game for over a decade and NEVER had this issue come up by any of the players I've interacted with. This is a war game and they understand that. But I really can't believe the level of which you have sunk to with your confrontational-fight provoking potty mouth. I would bring it to the attention of the admins but I don't know if they really care about enforcing rules or not.

[/quote]
What isn't allowed is asking your in-game allies to ALSO attack them - that's coordination. "In game ally" really just means just that - a country that sends you some units to attack/defend - they are not people you can call on to gangbang someone else.
[/quote] Then why on earth is there a "Message your allies" button? Messaging allies should be forbidden if what you say is so sacred a part of this unwritten rule: http://www.earthempires.com/rules

Lol wait what? grantman77, I'm agreeing with you, and the rude part wasn't aimed at you, but at crest23.. there's a lot more to why I'm 'rude' towards him than just from this one thread.

grantman the solution is very simple here. feel free to message your allies to attack another country, just dont come here crying when you and your allies log in to a deleted country.

if you still dont understand then read this.

http://forums.earthempires.com/...&z=rule-clarification

If you dont like qwertyh having 3 off allies, just attack him and ruin his set! Whats the point of fluffing about it?

The amount of non-exclusive co-ordination would be insane.

Game theory says it's all or nothing. It's like reverse chicken.

EDIT: It's Volunteer's Dilemma.

@qwertyh:
You use a spreadsheet to play? Isn't that like getting the computer to play itself for you, except you have to waste your time entering all the data. Lol

Didn't you know I am a cyborg??

We won't be deleted because inspite of your "expert" analysis and the opinions of others I have privately contacted http://www.earthempires.com and was told I have nothing to worry about and that what I'm doing should be a normal part of the primary game server. *rim shot

Well then I apologize and hope that you will accept. More than just this thread to be rude to him? I should visit the forums more often-might be entertaining. Again that was my misunderstanding and I completely apologize.

I don't believe you. It's been deleted for before multiple times and is the officially established rule. If what you are saying actually is true, then whoever messaged you back is completely disconnected from how the game is actually moderated.

Scanned thru this thread.

If it's a 'solo' server, there shouldn't be any allies at all.
That's what solo is.

If there are any rules, they should be under server details, and rules, not inside some thread on the forums. Forum rules go on the forums.

I shouldn't HAVE to be forced to scan through hundreds of old posts on a forum to find server rules. They should be easily listed and if they aren't, you shouldn't be deleted for breaking some secret rule that isn't clearly written on the main page under RULES.

I agree with Sir Bloodstone about having to search the forums for game rules. I know many players that aren't even signed up on the forum. I posted a thread like this not more than a week ago and everyone was helpful and I understand reasoning but I still don't fully agree. There were a lot of examples and hypothetical situations given but for every one given I'm sure there could be one to counter. The rules and policies in place in this game are starting to borderline on ridiculous. I am a returning E2025 player and lets just say alot has changed. If I hadn't been proactive and took to the forum I would not know many of these changes. I think it hurts a vast majority of the casual players that aren't as proactive as I. I just don't like some of the restrictions put in place in this game, Allies in general you can argue are being rendered useless, AB,BR,GS,Missiles under the GDI restrictions you can consider useless depending how you play your country. This is head scratching to some of the old E2025 players. Alot of players on the forum argue this has made the game "better" and "more fair" but that is a matter of opinion if you ask me because I still see MANY purple countries and people still find ways to cheat and expose things. That dosn't mean there shouldn't be rules but at what cost? "Earth Empires is a free browser based strategy game where you take control of your nation's MILITARY and economy. Command your country's MILITARY to attack and defend against your enemies. Execute attack strategies to relieve opponents of their resources and land. I think a large Military aspect of this game had been rendered useless, Just an observation but there used to be thousands of people playing this game now just 500 on primary.

Excuse me grantman? When and who did you contact at earthempires.com?

nextly to both grantman and bloodstone, you don't have to scan through the forums to find the rules. They are stickied at the very top. The reason they are posted on these specific forums is because the rules posted on earthempires.com is for ALL servers. These ones posted here are specific solo server rules added in addition to due to abuse.
OA allies will be removed soon per qzjul's post.
lastly I am shocked blid, or crest or one of you all did not direct me to this thread ;) You all are slacking!

You're busy today Galleri. You deserve a break!!

Moral of the story, don't use OAs?

Galleri said leeching is perfectly legal. It just pisses off your competitors I suppose. Lots of top countries were leeching tech and OA's this set.

As for the leeching tech allies, it honestly isn't against any rule. And like qzjul and martian said.... the OA's will go away soon.

Wouldn't you have to get rid of DA's as well. Isn't it going to be more difficult to attack if just your offensive military is going against a country and its defensive allies turrets?

Not at all. PS grants a 50% bonus. If you have 2 equally sized (in turret count) Defensive allies, that is also +50% bonus.

^^ Only if your target has a 1/1 ratio. Most top people are more likely to be turret heavy.