pheer me, how has your guys sets been?

Enforce real 5 man teams already! :P

Yah, do that. Starting next set since this one is already underway.

My suggestion on how to do it I think is quite simple:

1) Do not allow teams to make more than one tag. Teams are supposed to be 5 players.
2) Allow teams to make non-aggression pacts and negotiate reps, retals, trades, etc. with other teams freely
3) Do NOT allow uninstigated multi-tag coordinated attacks.

So, for example, everyone who participated in this:
http://www.eestats.com/team/country/81
would be deleted if they did it next set.

Anyway, pretty simple I think.

great, i've been killing little weiners


i mean whiners

oh im sure youre slayin weiners on the reg trife

i agree entirely with blid. this server could be so much better than it is if only we took basic and simple steps towards enforcing not only the spirit of the server but the idea of the server on a whole.

naps are fun, so nine tags can all be allied, as in not attack each other, but once they work together to attack anybody mods delete them for cheating.

please?

5 player teams are like hard-coded into the game itself, adn trife says "whiner" for asking for there to be 5 player teams. KINDA FUny

lol, good one :)

ugh, i have too many handles

but only two love handles :(

cross team efforts should be minimalized, countries breaking rules should be frozen until further explained. if say a country suicides on 2 teams at once, then i think its okay for them to kill it together, otherwise restricting inter-team efforts would be nice.

Yeah hsifreta, I agree, that's why I said "uninstigated" in my rule 3. If it's instigated, have at it

he raises good points- thia is where game mods whom actively follow the server come into play. in that situation both tags would, apart from the other, be carrying out the same actions, ie killing. but without both having been wronged originally, working together is delete worthy.

a grey area, yes, but this is why wed trust the mods to police us. it is he fairest way anybody has suggested.

We've been waiting for real 5-man teams for a long time.

Afaik also suggested a rule for a "Team GDI" where you can't actually do aggressive attacks against a team unless they have done more than 2 attacks:

odd, i don't see anything in the server details that states that teams cannot be allied and/or work together.

i don't like FAing top the top 10 in alliance server, but since within the rules of the game it's allowed to happen

5-player teams are coded into the server itself. wjhat's the ponit of that, if y'all just linking 5-player teams to make a 20-player alliance. that's obviously circumventing the intention of the server

right so just wanted to confirm that you guys were whining and moaning about us 'breaking unwritten rules'

10-4, over and out

No, Trife - we are whining about having a bunch of douches ruin the server. Your facts seem to be out of alignment sir.

doesn't seem to be an unwritten rule, seems to be an actual rule judging by the qzjul post above?

is kind of right about breaking unwritten rules though.

i don't know, i think it takes some pretty massive blinders to wave it away and say 'oh you and your unwritten rules' when it *is* written, in the game code itself no less, and when qzjul has written as well, personally, in a post quoted in this very thread, that it's 'abuse'

let us have more than five in a tag, or enforce the five man team aspect of the.. wait for it.. team server

i live to love you, trife, but youre on the wrong side of this one my friend :(

the game code sets the limit for each team at 5 members. nothing is written into the game code, or the game rules/server details saying anything to the effect of 'different teams cannot work together or participate in killruns together'

if the game admins actually wrote that (diff teams can't work/kill together) into the game code or the server details, then you'd have a point. but then you'd have to define what constitutes working/killing together, and a system/review that prevents it. if a guy suicides on 3 different teams, which team has the right to kill him?

but agian, until the "game code" or server details/game rules make different teams working together against the rules of the server - all you're doing is biatching and moaning. just like people do in alliance about land trading, FA chains, farming untags, FSing smaller alliances. each and every one of those things is legal.

#ijustjudgejudy'edyoasses

some things shouldn't need to be said. but nevertheless, qzjul said it. see quoted post.

yep. we are aware that there is abuse occuring. I don't think that statement can be construed to mean that 'we' agree that every instance of one team helping another constitutes ABUSE of the game.

I do agree that this server doesn't work how we expected as it is and we are working to change that. but until it is something else, it is still what it is. hmmm.

sure, he said those quoted things on Aug 4th 2012

why hasn't it made it into the actual rules for the server?

a forum post does not mean official rules. he's talking about changes/suggestions in that thread. but, for arguments sake, lets say that forum post is the official rules. why hasn't it been enforced in 1.5 years? it's not like teams working together is a new thing, is it? and by your own posts, the anti-TSO crowd is guilty of doing the exact same thing?

he says why in the post. he thinks moderation would be hard, except for after-the-fact. (i personally think it would work.) so he thinks, instead of moderation, he needs to make game engine changes or find new ideas, which is a long-term kind of project, esp with all the time spent on alliance

Actually, a big change since then is the restart change. NOW if people were deleted after the fact, and the killed player got to restart with the new restart rules, the victim would come out without losing all that much and the abusers would be set back hugely. Delete for cross-tag fluff once or twice and it would instantly be almost completely eradicated.

so who gets to decide which cross-tag stuff isn't allowed? ha! lets make it another crippled solo server for 5 people to play at once. may as well let those 5 people share their own market as well, to further reduce the risk of cross-tag trading.

hmm

Why would only 5 people play?

I think the below is simple and would work fine (basically, outlaw the uninstigated cross-tag kill/crippple runs)

The current set up is actually already driving people off the server you know.

good suggestion. now, put something like that into the actual rules, with definitions/examples of cross tag stuff that doesn't lay within the spirit of the rules of the server and baby, you've got a stew going!

don't get me wrong, i like some of these ideas i've seen posted as to how to actually enforce the 'spirit' of the server and wouldn't be opposed to some of them... my whole point is that TSO is not, and has not been breaking game rules. and thusly, all blid/ingle/crest's posts recently just amount to biatching and moaning and crying. just like 'omg NO FA chains/landtrading/farming of untags/FSing of smaller allainces' is in the alliance servers.

anyways, back to work. here's a tissue for y'all.

lol wow anyway =]

we derailed your thread

it was super effective!

pfft, if you want to see derailed just have blid and myself start up a conversation about bolshevism.. then it'll REALLY be derailed ;)

Trife, what I don't get is why exactly you guys insist on trying to drive everybody off of this server? I get that it was for the lulz for a few months - but its been over half a year - none of us want to fight anymore. We have offered Boltar pacts with any retal terms he might want to end this thing and yet set after set you guys just insist on pushing the same buttons. We are down under 10 members still playing on the whole server, you guys win - get the fluff over it all ready.

their intent isn't to drive everybody off the server. if that were indeed the case, then being their friends wouldn't matter and i would've been killed off with nary a fight many, many times. i think it's the vitriol that surrounds the whole "fight" that fuels them.

whether one is right or the other wrong or not, this is an issue more with the lack of moderation on the server more so than the actual players on the server.

the admins or mods have had literally years to resolve the issue, yet continue not to enforce a single aspect of what is supposed to differentiate this server from alliance.

this, of course, does not tacitly remove erring or wrongdoing, mind you. bolts and i had a few hiccups earlier before it was determined we'd not war each other, ie diplomacy to prevent any such occurrences. if i recall, archy, you benefited from this arrangement while with us (by the way, you're always and forever welcomed back, my friend!)

so much blame being put everywhere, so very little actual communication :(

i will happily play the ambassador to the detente between ya'll, where we all come out friends (mostly where i am known as the greatest team server diplomat of ALL TIME! ;p)

alls i ask is that trife sends me the catalog of kitten toys he had [erroneously] mailed to him, and boltar sends me before and after pics of him on the ac boardwalk (before he gets to the boardwalk, and after he's arrived at the boardwalk)

they were never going to stop braden, there were dozens of posts last set, entering the 5th month of war, asking them if they would ever stop and saying it had gotten ridiculous. it was just ignored. no attempt to engage in ending it because they weren't interested in that. if you had been a part of etft you couldn't have gotten them to agree to peace. they agreed to peace with you so they could focus on warring etft and their allies. tso got the fluff beat out of them for the first few sets of war and so would never stop until they had reestablished dominance, as they like being the kings of this fluffty server and able to do whatever they wish. so now the netters got war fatigue and left, and they're hunting down untagged countries and first striking small teams. now i guess it's over because everybody quit, and that was the only way it was ever gonna end

i finished second on the server while tagged etft.. or eftf.. or whichever variation it may have been, either way, my ability to be friends with both sides allowed me to play as i wished to, with little to no threat from either side, while literally tagged in their opposition.

do you want to resolve the issue, or continue to verbally attack them? who is right or who is wrong? did you, along with more than four other players in your single tag, fight them? then you should have been deleted, alongside them being deleted, for nobodys sake but the benefit of the server.

you, AND them. who is to blame? you? them? or the moderators to whom the server was entrusted and who then ever refused to lift a finger?

we needn't fight each other, what we need is all of us to take a united front and endeavor to the game admins actually to make this server, to force by active moderation, this server into what it should and was only ever intended to be.

so long as you're on one bloc fighting another bloc, you are both simultaneously ruining the server for those of us who wish nothing but to play on even or level playing fields.

when i'm the voice of reason, the voice of legitimacy, you should understand something has gone terribly, terribly wrong :(

the issue is resolved braden, everyone quit. until that happened, they woudln't have stopped. that's just a fact. don't you realize it's possible that one side would insist on warring against the other side's wishes, with no recourse for the attacked side? that's possible, isn't it? im not attacking tso here, just saying how it is. etft was fighting unwillingly for 5 months before they quit with TSO never willing to negotiate. if you had played in etft, you would die. you lived because you made a neutral tag while etft got killed. TSO doesnt WANT the multi-tag alliances ended either. they like them because they can use that to dominate the server. boltar's been asked a billion times to stop doing it and refuses, because he wants to be king

no, i lived while within the etft tag, or at the very least under their auspices (because, well, both sides are guilty of the inherent issue with this server, that being multiple tags not being deleted for coordination)

i started out in rd, where we dominated the server. we drove mkr and many others out, having killed them, we were the first, we set the gold standard, so to speak that tso now trades off.

With the help of deli i realized the error of our ways, and since then have simply only ever wanted this server to be fixed.

there isn't a line drawn in the sand between us players, the line needs to be drawn between us players and the admins who refuse to fix the server or enforce the existing rules, which are quite obvious to anybody that doesn't wish to refute the obvious, which is five vs five is fun, six vs five, or sixteen, or sixty vs five ruins the enjoyment for EVERYBODY who plays.

my only desire is for this server to work. i love it, and refuse to give up on it. ingle being driven from anywhere is a shame, as him playing makes the game more fun for anybody else who gets the pleasure of competing against him or playing with him. i will say the same for you, and any number of other people. silent wolf, for example, i met when i was thirteen years old, fourteen years ago. him playing makes me happy. him not playing makes me less than happy.

tso is not to blame, as far as i see it :( i can only hope we fix the server and ya'll return, because, as i said, it's more fun with you all here

and bolts, regardless of any game aspects, in some of our hearts, you will always be king <3 ;)

Braden, I'd love to go back - but I willingly left being neutral behind to stand up to injustice. In a way, I have picked up the torch that the ETFT guys threw down. I will never lick the boot, I will not net while a gang of bullies is driving other innocent netters off of the server.

I benefited from TSO, and I played with them - but Boltar does not just bear a striking resemblance to hugo chavez, he became him. The savior became the oppressor. I will not rest until Robespierre has his turn under the blade, until TSO's head is lying in the basket. Viva la' Team!

CHAVISMO!!!

sorry, it's too fun a word not to scream :P

but maximilien de references will only ever further divide :( divide as in head from body. IT'S RAINING TERROR, OH SORRY, WRONG RAIN :( history is fun :P but he also was pro reformation, in whatever sense you may apply it to it- be it revolutionary france or anti catholicism.., was anti death penalty and he was pro equal rights.. none of which can realistically be applied to tso on this server, as they are anti revolutionary, don't mention the holy see of rome, at all, and are decidedly pro death penatly, so to speak, and arguably against equality.. love the reference, but where do i misunderstand its relation to the server?

vive le archaic pour la vie!

well, they killed me before I fired a shot

It would be great if 5 man teams were made realistic in some enforceable way but there will always be people looking to abuse the system. The only reason the current mess has gone on for so long is because neither side will admit fault or has tried to end the conflict. Without that, any sort of peace would be pointless as the same events that caused the problem would be repeated. The wars will likely continue for many more sets because of this.

while it's not in the rules, i would agree that having a 5 man team experience is more fun and challenging than having "another" alliance experience. so right now, people are bringing forth suggestions and not complaining about the works.

i agree with the Team GDI, but only if it also protects against farming.

surely there's a way, say if you hardcode into the game that teams cannot coordinate or work together, eg. GDI or a single tag war dec requirement to special attacks, mods will not need time to moderate the server. or increase team size to 10 so people can defend themselves properly, but i have an inkling feeling that teams of 5 is geared towards netting more than warring, hence 5 rather than higher numbers per tag.

so basically, the rules themselves imply the server for a team-netting challenge, but being inadequate, what they are actually doing is encouraging a gan grape environment. (eg. reality between unwritten and written rules)